Feinstein Just Lied On Senate Floor
Senator Feinstein just blatantly lied saying that the FBI interviewed nobody that the Ford team said could corroborate her claims. That is blatantly and patently false. They interviewed Judge, Keyser, PJ. They all failed to corroborate her claim.
These lies from liberals must be held accountable!
Comments
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@reformed said:
Senator Feinstein just blatantly lied saying that the FBI interviewed nobody that the Ford team said could corroborate her claims. That is blatantly and patently false. They interviewed Judge, Keyser, PJ. They all failed to corroborate her claim.These lies from liberals must be held accountable!
Your liberal lies hypothesis is predicated on at least one necessary premise. Let's test it:
Please provide links to quotations from Dr Ford or her attorneys - whether in newspaper articles, other documents, or media interviews - in which Ford or her "camp" claimed Mark Judge, Leyland Keyser, or PJ Smyth would "corroborate her claims." To my knowledge - and I am open to the correction of the links you provide - Dr Ford has claimed ONLY that those three were in the house when and where her assault occurred - Judge, in the upstairs room along with Kavanaugh; Keyser and Smyth, on the first floor of the house. To my open-to-correction knowledge, neither Dr. Ford nor her "camp" has claimed that any of those three would corroborate her story.
Through a letter from her attorneys to FBI Director Chris Wray, however, she HAS asserted that there are at least eight witnesses who would offer testimony supportive of her case, witnesses who would show she spoke of the alleged assault in 2012, 2013, 2016, and 2017 - well before the Kavanaugh nomination - and would attest to other aspects of her character and conduct (e.g. regarding her polygraph test). The attorneys' letter DOES claim that the FBI did not interview THOSE EIGHT CORROBORATIVE WITNESSES.
I did not hear Sen Feinstein's comments, but I think it's possible they referred NOT to Judge, Keyser, or Smyth - none of whom Ford has claimed would "corroborate" her claims - but rather to the witnesses identified and described in the letter from Dr Ford's attorneys. I await the links you'll provide on the corroboration question regarding Judge, Keyser, and Smyth.
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@Bill_Coley said:
@reformed said:
Senator Feinstein just blatantly lied saying that the FBI interviewed nobody that the Ford team said could corroborate her claims. That is blatantly and patently false. They interviewed Judge, Keyser, PJ. They all failed to corroborate her claim.These lies from liberals must be held accountable!
Your liberal lies hypothesis is predicated on at least one necessary premise. Let's test it:
Please provide links to quotations from Dr Ford or her attorneys - whether in newspaper articles, other documents, or media interviews - in which Ford or her "camp" claimed Mark Judge, Leyland Keyser, or PJ Smyth would "corroborate her claims." To my knowledge - and I am open to the correction of the links you provide - Dr Ford has claimed ONLY that those three were in the house when and where her assault occurred - Judge, in the upstairs room along with Kavanaugh; Keyser and Smyth, on the first floor of the house. To my open-to-correction knowledge, neither Dr. Ford nor her "camp" has claimed that any of those three would corroborate her story.
If they say they witnessed the event, then they are claiming that it would be corroborated. Those are the only people that could corroborate since they were the only ones alleged to be there. There is nobody else that could corroborate her story.
Through a letter from her attorneys to FBI Director Chris Wray, however, she HAS asserted that there are at least eight witnesses who would offer testimony supportive of her case, witnesses who would show she spoke of the alleged assault in 2012, 2013, 2016, and 2017 - well before the Kavanaugh nomination - and would attest to other aspects of her character and conduct (e.g. regarding her polygraph test). The attorneys' letter DOES claim that the FBI did not interview THOSE EIGHT CORROBORATIVE WITNESSES.
Who are those eight witnesses? People who she told 30 years later? That's not a corroborating witness, that is hearsay. In other words, not allowed. That's also why the FBI probably didn't talk to them. They don't count.
I did not hear Sen Feinstein's comments, but I think it's possible they referred NOT to Judge, Keyser, or Smyth - none of whom Ford has claimed would "corroborate" her claims - but rather to the witnesses identified and described in the letter from Dr Ford's attorneys. I await the links you'll provide on the corroboration question regarding Judge, Keyser, and Smyth.
It would be impossible for those witnesses to corroborate the event. They are nothing but people with hearsay "evidence." They don't count Bill.
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@reformed said:
If they say they witnessed the event, then they are claiming that it would be corroborated. Those are the only people that could corroborate since they were the only ones alleged to be there. There is nobody else that could corroborate her story.
You mis-state the facts.
Neither Dr. Ford nor her "camp" claims Keyser or Smyth "witnessed the event." She claims the assault happened on the second floor of a house on whose first floor Keyser and Smyth were located. In addition, Dr. Ford does NOT say she said ANYTHING to either of them after the assault.
As for Mark Judge, Dr Ford claims he participated in the assault, or at least was an accessory to it. So yes, she claims he "witnessed the event," but she no more would expect him to "corroborate" her claim than she would expect Kavanaugh to "corroborate" it!
Would you recommend we change the constitution to compel alleged criminals to testify in their trials? Afterall, they allegedly "witnessed the event" of their crimes, which in your view means they could corroborate the charges! [Since the alleged criminals, who the prosecutors claimed witnessed the events, would be "corroborating" witnesses in your view, and they would most likely deny that the crimes even happened, well, I guess that would mean the alleged criminals were innocent! Sure would clear up the crowded justice system!]
Who are those eight witnesses? People who she told 30 years later? That's not a corroborating witness, that is hearsay. In other words, not allowed. That's also why the FBI probably didn't talk to them. They don't count.
The issue is not why the FBI didn't talk to them. The issue is whether there are witnesses the FBI did not interview to whom Sen Feinstein might have been referring in her comments you criticized as blatant lies. I propose that the answer is yes - the eight persons identified in the letter to FBI Director Wray from Dr. Ford's attorneys, eight people the letter claims would support Dr Ford's character and claims, but whom the FBI did not talk to.
It would be impossible for those witnesses to corroborate the event. They are nothing but people with hearsay "evidence." They don't count Bill.
The issue is NOT whether you think the eight witnesses identified in Dr Ford's attorneys' letter "count." The issue is the veracity of your claim that Sen Feinstein "blatantly and patently" lied in her comments.
That's why I asked you to back up your claim with quotations from anyone in the Ford camp, instances where they claimed Judge, Keyser, and Smyth would "corroborate" her claims. You have not done so, most likely because you can't do so, because your claim is false.
Whether you agree with the Ford camp's assertions about those eight witnesses is completely irrelevant to the issue of whether Sen Feinstein lied in her comments. The only issues are does the Ford camp contend they support her claims (yes) and did the FBI talk to any of them in their investigation (no). Hence, to those witnesses Sen Feinstein may well have been referring in her comments, and NOT Keyser, Judge, or Smyth, whom the Ford camp has NOT claimed would support her claim.
Bottom Line: You have yet to demonstrate the truth of your claim that Sen Feinstein "blatantly and patently" lied in her comments, and I have shown a reasonable, credible, and documented interpretation of her comments that shows they were in fact truthful.
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@Bill_Coley said:
@reformed said:
If they say they witnessed the event, then they are claiming that it would be corroborated. Those are the only people that could corroborate since they were the only ones alleged to be there. There is nobody else that could corroborate her story.
You mis-state the facts.
Neither Dr. Ford nor her "camp" claims Keyser or Smyth "witnessed the event." She claims the assault happened on the second floor of a house on whose first floor Keyser and Smyth were located. In addition, Dr. Ford does NOT say she said ANYTHING to either of them after the assault.
This is true. However, she does state Keyser was at the event but Keyser said that there was no event where all those pepole were present. In other words, she did not corroborate her story.
As for Mark Judge, Dr Ford claims he participated in the assault, or at least was an accessory to it. So yes, she claims he "witnessed the event," but she no more would expect him to "corroborate" her claim than she would expect Kavanaugh to "corroborate" it!
Fair enough.
Would you recommend we change the constitution to compel alleged criminals to testify in their trials? Afterall, they allegedly "witnessed the event" of their crimes, which in your view means they could corroborate the charges! [Since the alleged criminals, who the prosecutors claimed witnessed the events, would be "corroborating" witnesses in your view, and they would most likely deny that the crimes even happened, well, I guess that would mean the alleged criminals were innocent! Sure would clear up the crowded justice system!]
Or the crime didn't actually happen and there was nothing to testify about. And no, the 5th ammendment stands.
Who are those eight witnesses? People who she told 30 years later? That's not a corroborating witness, that is hearsay. In other words, not allowed. That's also why the FBI probably didn't talk to them. They don't count.
The issue is not why the FBI didn't talk to them. The issue is whether there are witnesses the FBI did not interview to whom Sen Feinstein might have been referring in her comments you criticized as blatant lies. I propose that the answer is yes - the eight persons identified in the letter to FBI Director Wray from Dr. Ford's attorneys, eight people the letter claims would support Dr Ford's character and claims, but whom the FBI did not talk to.
But they could not corroborate the story. You must at least admit that. If you want to split hairs on Feinstein I guess you could twist it to say she was being truthful, but I still disagree.
It would be impossible for those witnesses to corroborate the event. They are nothing but people with hearsay "evidence." They don't count Bill.
The issue is NOT whether you think the eight witnesses identified in Dr Ford's attorneys' letter "count." The issue is the veracity of your claim that Sen Feinstein "blatantly and patently" lied in her comments.
Feinstein said that witnesses who could corroborate the event were not interviewed and that simply is not true. The ones who could actually corroborate something were interviewed and did not corroborate anything.
That's why I asked you to back up your claim with quotations from anyone in the Ford camp, instances where they claimed Judge, Keyser, and Smyth would "corroborate" her claims. You have not done so, most likely because you can't do so, because your claim is false.
Only in Bill's world.
Whether you agree with the Ford camp's assertions about those eight witnesses is completely irrelevant to the issue of whether Sen Feinstein lied in her comments. The only issues are does the Ford camp contend they support her claims (yes) and did the FBI talk to any of them in their investigation (no). Hence, to those witnesses Sen Feinstein may well have been referring in her comments, and NOT Keyser, Judge, or Smyth, whom the Ford camp has NOT claimed would support her claim.
The others don't count. They aren't corroborating witnesses and therefore couldn't be said to be such so Feinstein, if she didn't lie, at least mislead and deceived to make it sound like the FBI didn't do something they should.
Bottom Line: You have yet to demonstrate the truth of your claim that Sen Feinstein "blatantly and patently" lied in her comments, and I have shown a reasonable, credible, and documented interpretation of her comments that shows they were in fact truthful.
At best she was deceptive.
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Odd thing, Deception. I once had an employer (vitriolic Democrat) who would dare to tell a bald-faced lie around a conference table that she knew everyone there knew was a lie. She knew such lies --could not be disproven but she told them to gain personal legal or technical advantage--always an economic advantage (she would rock in her chair and say, "Its all about money--it's all about money"). It was all a political game for her. She had no expectation anyone would believe her, but she had power and position and her unrefutable lies held technically legal sway.
That is just the kind of birds we are dealing with.
