Trinity ... and the excuse of "human limitations", etc

Bill_Coley

@Keep_Smiling_4_Jesus posted:

Searching Lexham Hebrew Bible (LHB) for <LogosMorphHeb ~ R???S??> INTERSECTS <Person God> finds 6,748 singular pronouns

Thank you for the additional details.

[Deleted User]

To me, the ONEness of the plural UNIFIED God is Substantial.

Truth is however, that the Bible nowhere (!) speaks of a "Unified God"; nowhere is God said to be or described as a "unified" anything (family, team, group, duo, trio, quartet, etc).

Thus, your conclusion regarding the significance of singular vs plural pronouns is quite obviously incorrect.

A singular pronoun being used for the Heb word elohim being plural has nothing to do with elohim indicating a plurality of elohim (voices, persons, individuals) being "unified". Rather, when elohim is connected with singular pronouns and verbs, it refers to the one supreme above all other God; when connected with plural pronouns and verbs, it refers to plural mighty ones, gods.

Bill_Coley

@Wolfgang posted:

A singular pronoun being used for the Heb word elohim being plural has nothing to do with elohim indicating a plurality of elohim (voices, persons, individuals) being "unified". Rather, when elohim is connected with singular pronouns and verbs, it refers to the one supreme above all other God; when connected with plural pronouns and verbs, it refers to plural mighty ones, gods.

Well stated, Wolfgang. FWIW, I agree.

Keep_Smiling_4_Jesus

@Keep_Smiling_4_Jesus To me, the ONEness of the plural UNIFIED God is Substantial.

@Wolfgang Truth is however, that the Bible nowhere (!) speaks of a "Unified God"; nowhere is God said to be or described as a "unified" anything (family, team, group, duo, trio, quartet, etc).

Agree "unified" is not in the Bible as a description of God. Humanly living & learning => the ONEness of the plural Unique God is Substantial (reflecting words in Deuteronomy 6:4)

@Wolfgang A singular pronoun being used for the Heb word elohim being plural has nothing to do with elohim indicating a plurality of elohim (voices, persons, individuals) being "unified". Rather, when elohim is connected with singular pronouns and verbs, it refers to the one supreme above all other God; when connected with plural pronouns and verbs, it refers to plural mighty ones, gods.

@Bill_Coley Well stated, Wolfgang. FWIW, I agree.

Please explain plural elohim with plural pronouns in Genesis 1:26 (LEB) And God said, “Let us make humankind in our image and according to our likeness, and let them rule over the fish of the sea, and over the birds of heaven, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every moving thing that moves upon the earth.”

Did elohim (God) make a mistake in the inspiration of plural pronouns in Genesis 1:26 ?

Genesis 1:27 is an example where a singular pronoun (his image) is used with elohim (God)

Keep Smiling 😊

[Deleted User]

@Keep_Smiling_4_Jesus

Please explain plural elohim with plural pronouns in Genesis 1:26 (LEB) And God said, “Let us make humankind in our image and according to our likeness, and let them rule over the fish of the sea, and over the birds of heaven, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every moving thing that moves upon the earth.”

Hmn... let us see .... am I a unified plural human, since I used "us" in sole reference to me by means of a relatively common figure of speech called idiom ?

The explanation that the "us" in v.26 is given in v.27 where the same "us" is literally not a unified "us", but a single "he".

Did elohim (God) make a mistake in the inspiration of plural pronouns in Genesis 1:26 ?

No ... he simply spoke oh HIMself as "us" ... The mistake is made in people not understanding the use of the figure of speech and taking "us" literally as meaning "more than one" which they then use to "prove" a "Plural (Three) God", or - as you do - to make the idea look more appealing, they then talk about a "unified" or "plural unique" God.

Genesis 1:27 is an example where a singular pronoun (his image) is used with elohim (God)

See above .... here is the answer to your earlier question in plain sight.

Keep_Smiling_4_Jesus

@Wolfgang Hmn... let us see .... am I a unified plural human, since I used "us" in sole reference to me by means of a relatively common figure of speech called idiom ?

One plural unique God created humans so every human has their own unique voice (and name). An answer of No for your question assumes you have not invited spiritual being(s) inside. Mark 5:1-20 describes one human that had a legion of demons inside.

@Wolfgang The explanation that the "us" in v.26 is given in v.27 where the same "us" is literally not a unified "us", but a single "he".

Explanation begets question: why "us" in Genesis 1:26. Why not "Let me make humankind in my image ..." (using all singular pronouns)

Does "figure of speech" really explain God's inspired word choice ?

Keep Smiling 😊

[Deleted User]

@Keep_Smiling_4_Jesus One plural unique God created humans so every human has their own unique voice (and name). An answer of No for your question assumes you have not invited spiritual being(s) inside. Mark 5:1-20 describes one human that had a legion of demons inside.

You did not want to understand what I had said, did you? Your comment is totally beside the point being discussed.

@Wolfgang The explanation that the "us" in v.26 is given in v.27 where the same "us" is literally not a unified "us", but a single "he".

@Keep_Smiling_4_Jesus Explanation begets question: why "us" in Genesis 1:26. Why not "Let me make humankind in my image ..." (using all singular pronouns)

No question to be begged if and when one has a bit of an understanding of the use and purpose of figures of speech used in place of plain literal statements ... I would have thought that you were sufficiently familiar with principles of language, in particular the differences in use and purpose of using literal language or figures of speech ...

Does "figure of speech" really explain God's inspired word choice ?

I would think that God's choice of words is deliberate and with a purpose and not a mistake or error. Thus, in light of (a) the immediate context (v. 27 -- he, his) and (b) the overall context that the true God is a SINGLE Being and not a group, union, team, familiy of a plural number of beings, it should be clear that the use of "us, our" in v. 26 involves a figure of speech by which a plural "us, our" is used in place of "I, my", as these pronouns refer to the SINGLE Being God.

Why God spoke of Himself in this manner, would have to do with adding emphasis to the words He proclaimed there .. He does not explain further details about His word choice. There are many more places in Scripture where God speaks of Himself with "I, my", and no explanation is given why He did so in those places either.

Keep_Smiling_4_Jesus

@Wolfgang Hmn... let us see .... am I a unified plural human, since I used "us" in sole reference to me by means of a relatively common figure of speech called idiom ?

@Keep_Smiling_4_Jesus One plural unique God created humans so every human has their own unique voice (and name). An answer of No for your question assumes you have not invited spiritual being(s) inside. Mark 5:1-20 describes one human that had a legion of demons inside.

@Wolfgang You did not want to understand what I had said, did you? Your comment is totally beside the point being discussed.

Humans were created by Holy God in the singular image of God => every human has their own singular unique voice, mind, soul, and strength.

After inviting demons inside his body, the one human in Mark 5:1-20 was not unified with the plurality (thousands) of Legion voices hating God.

@Wolfgang The explanation that the "us" in v.26 is given in v.27 where the same "us" is literally not a unified "us", but a single "he".

@Keep_Smiling_4_Jesus Explanation begets question: why "us" in Genesis 1:26. Why not "Let me make humankind in my image ..." (using all singular pronouns)

@Wolfgang No question to be begged if and when one has a bit of an understanding of the use and purpose of figures of speech used in place of plain literal statements ... I would have thought that you were sufficiently familiar with principles of language, in particular the differences in use and purpose of using literal language or figures of speech ...

Hypothesis: if literal meaning of Bible text appears unbelieveable, then the text should be treated as a "figure of speech"

Caveat: increasing Holy Righteous God Loving ❤️ knowledge is helping me appreciate God's amazing attention to detail (magnitude is absolutely mind boggling). Am learning to seek literal truth in God's Words over figures of speech (includes me asking God to help me see Holy God's truth).

@Keep_Smiling_4_Jesus Does "figure of speech" really explain God's inspired word choice ?

@Wolfgang I would think that God's choice of words is deliberate and with a purpose and not a mistake or error. Thus, in light of (a) the immediate context (v. 27 -- he, his) and (b) the overall context that the true God is a SINGLE Being and not a group, union, team, familiy of a plural number of beings, it should be clear that the use of "us, our" in v. 26 involves a figure of speech by which a plural "us, our" is used in place of "I, my", as these pronouns refer to the SINGLE Being God.

Concur Holy God's inspired word choice is deliberate and true. Different faith beliefs about the essence of One God results in different thoughts about Genesis 1:26-27 (to me, literally true & consistent => plural unique)

@Wolfgang Why God spoke of Himself in this manner, would have to do with adding emphasis to the words He proclaimed there .. He does not explain further details about His word choice. There are many more places in Scripture where God speaks of Himself with "I, my", and no explanation is given why He did so in those places either.

Concur God inspired more singular personal pronouns over plural ones. To me, plural unique God is unified: that is, never does one voice of God contradict another. Showing God's Love that truly seeks the best for another is incredibly difficult to do/demonstrate using a single voice.

Keep Smiling 😊